Hugh-cy, You Got Some ‘Splaining To Do
A little while back, the Black Rod had a post that made mention of Shae Greenfield’s dual political allegiances. Given the relative unease of some of the redder Tories vis-à-vis how much pull social conservatives have within the federal Tory party, this was not a totally shocking phenomenon. As an avowed social Liberal and fiscal Conservative, I myself am guilty of straddling the Liberal and Conservative divide.
It seems that in his travels, Shae has caught a strain of Trudeaumania that seems to afflict a certain percentage of diehard Liberals:
“As you may have gleaned from my photo with the man on my homepage, I am a supporter of Justin Trudeau’s (dare I say it) intentions to run for a seat in Parliament in the Montreal riding of Outrement.”
A rundown of his father’s legacy shows that Justin has big shoes to fill:
1) Increasing Canada’s national debt from $18 billion to $200 billion.
2) Rampant inflation during his administrative tenure.
3) The National Energy Program – mention these magic words to any Calgarian and they still clutch their hearts with all the fervour of Fred Sanford.
The Liberal Party at the tail end of the Trudeau era was also against free trade, an economic tenet that even our own Gary Doer now recognizes as a mechanism for global prosperity. My impression was that the Trudeau brand was anathema to people motivated enough to join the Progressive Conservative party here in Manitoba. If the former president of the PC Youth can see fit to support the potential second coming of P.E.T., just how virulent could Trudeaumania be elsewhere in the provincial Tory camp? Will Doer actually be the bigger fiscal conservative in the next election? Is that why there are all of those Manitoba Means Business billboards dotting the landscape?
Shae, although I am still one degree away from my doctorate, I would like to prescribe the following for your bout of Trudeaumania: take two Peter C. Newmans (I recommend Here Be Dragons and The Secret Mulroney Tapes) and call me in the morning.
Motivational Tunes:
Motorhead – Eat The Rich
Jane’s Addiction – Just BecausePeter Murphy – Cuts You Up
Catherine Wheel - Waydown
posted by Unapologetic Ex-Winnipegger @ 12:40 PM
21 comments
21 Comments:
Trudeau was a terrible PM, thank God for Mulroney!
Mulroney had one heck of a mess on his hands when he got the keys to Sussex. It's only years later that his policies (wildly unpopular at the time) bore fruit. The economy has enjoyed record expansion due to free trade while the government is now flush with cash from the GST. I for one would prefer that Harper leave consumption taxes in place and reduce income taxes instead.
Did he have his faults? Sure, but his legacy is far better than Trudeau's.
If I may interject for a moment in my own defense, I'd like to make a few points. The first is that Mulroney, himself was opposed to the Free Trade Agreement in the 1983 PC Leadership race, then supported it in power, but that's irrelevant.
I support a highly centralized federal government. That, and that alone, is the element of the Trudeau legacy which I support. I have said for years that while I disagree with much of what Trudeau did, I have always been a fan of the way he did it.
Part of my post which seems to have been overlooked by many people was my point that I don't think Justin Trudeau is Pierre Trudeau. I believe that he has the charisma and intelligence of his father (something you cannot begrudge Pierre regardless of your feelings for him) and is a proponent of the centralized model of federalism which I support.
The final point is that I think that the minority of Canadians such as ourselves who follow politics so closely should be excited to see young, intelligent and charismatic candidates step forward - regardless of the party they sign on to represent. When I say that I mean people like a Gerard Kennedy, a James Moore, a Jamie Heath (who unfortunately lost the nomination for Ottawa Centre), or even a Richard Marceau who I had the pleasure of meeting in Montreal last month.
Finally, someone points out the former tiny Tory turncoat. I can't believe this kid went from being a PC to wanting to sleep with Trudeau. It's pretty sad.
From a tory hack to a Liberal wannabe hack. Pathetic.
Shea goes a little too far sometimes, I'll admit it, but his loyalty to the provincial tories is without question. Maybe if he'd spend a little more time talking provincially on his blog -or a little less time with the partisan anti-harper messages- others would see that.
I will concede that Trudeau did have charisma and resonated with the people of that time. I sincerely hope for the sake of our nation (and my kids) that the whole notion of government overspending is a thing of the past. I want to leave my kids a better legacy than backbreaking interest payments.
Seeing Sacha come to the defense of Hassan Almrei, a convicted terrorist (who is still in custody despite Sacha's efforts) conjures images of a young Pierre's flippant attitude to World War II. We also have Margaret wrapping herself in the Charter to beat a DUI rap. It seems that the apples are not falling far from the tree. If Justin is indeed taking a run at office I hope he proves me wrong. Not that I'm holding my breath...
To anonymous #2: If you have a problem with me, I'd appreciate you doing it to me with your name attached. You think I'm pathetic? At least I have the guts to sign my name to my comments. Get a life or a muzzle.
To anonymous #3: I appreciate your comments with regards to my provincial loyalty. I have specifically decided to focus solely on federal politics because I knew that if I ever even went so far as to question the tactics of a member of the PC Party of Manitoba, I'd be derided as a provincial turncoat. So I do not engage in the discussion at all. I have decided to let my record speak for itself, which includes several roles in the party since joining four years ago, which will not be ending any time soon. Stephen Harper is in no way affiliated with Manitoba or the PC Party of Manitoba and will keep whacking him as long as I disagree with him.
It's all great, free entertainment this political stuff. Without it we would simply hang from trees throwing avocadoes at one another
Don't worry, Shae is far far from any steering wheels with the PC party. He may say otherwise but his bridges have been burnt quite nicely already.
Brave Soul Anonymous #4,
Shae makes no claims about his standing in the PC Party of Manitoba. Shae does not need to make claims about his standing in the PC Party of Manitoba because so many other anonymous Manitobans such as yourself have done him the favor of making claims for him.
Shae - this is an honest question and not meant to be a personal attack. If you openly are a federal Liberal and a provincial Tory, why wouldn't you work to shore up the provincial Liberal brand given that's where your political leanings seem to be?
The provincial political scene is the only one I can think of that doesn't seek to leverage countless generations of brand name equity. If the Liberals were a stronger force in Manitoba, there wouldn't be such a dramatic swing along the political spectrum every 8-10 years. The NDP wins votes solely by Liberal default.
Imagine consumer confusion if Pepsi was Coke in Manitoba by virtue of Coke's reluctance to penetrate the Manitoba market...
Does anyone like my blue and red product analogy?
It does seem like a bit of a personal attack (not necessarily on your part but certainly on the part of anonymous others). But let me respond to your question with an honest response.
I have never been a conservative; I was a Tory. Toryism is, in many ways what the original Reformers were rebelling against as much as anything else. Toryism stresses social hierarchy (often confused with elitism by opponents) but also social responsibility. Toryism stresses the conservation of the environment and natural resources, as well as a responsibility of those who are better off to those with less. Modern Conservatism has become - at least in my view - a coalition of neo-conservatives and libertarians.
I left the Conservative Party of Canada because I came to believe that not only was Toryism within the party dead, but that it was dead because of the wishes of the party's membership. So I joined the party which I felt best represented my Tory views, which is the Liberal Party of Canada.
In Manitoba, I still see support for traditional Toryism within the provincial ranks, and so I've never felt that there was any reason to leave for another party. From my vantage point, I can still see vestiges of the Roblin and Filmon legacies.
If you were to look at the history of the Province of Manitoba and of the City of Winnipeg, you would see an interest dichotomy. Politically, Manitoba is in many ways a mut. We inherited in Winnipeg a combination of the European socialism and the Ontario "corporatism." As such, Manitoba and Winnipeg politics has long been a simple two-party system. You are either NDP or PC, with both parties straddling center and no party in between the two. That is why the Liberal party, as it has typically existed in Manitoba, sits to the left of the NDP, where the federal Liberal Party straddles the center.
My belief is that political convictions along the "right" and "left" spectrums follow the bell curve with 68% of Manitoba voters somewhere near the mushy middle.
I still contend that if the provincial Liberals got their act together, voters would not be going over 2 or 3 standard deviations to the left with the NDP. To Doer's credit, he has done an excellent job of persuading voters (and even by some of his actions) he is more moderate than his federal counterparts. This has enabled him to crowd the Liberals out of their own spot. If the provincial Liberals were a stronger force, the NDP wouldn't be able to encroach on their turf.
Maybe I am just loathe to believe my fellow Manitobans could be so malleable in their political convictions. ;)
The bottom line is the only person that takes Shae seriously in the PC party is Shae. If the libs ever get their Sh*t together provincially he'll be there cause he knows there is no $ to be made with the shitty work he's done for the the prov pc party. Blog on Greenfield, blog on...
Oh, Anonymous #5...
Unfortunately some of us aren't involved in politics for the money. I'm not asking the party for a red cent. That's not my motivation. As the defacto leader of the party, I felt you should know that. I'm just going to take a wild guess here and say that this most recent anonymous blogger is a student finishing off his degree and trying to pretend that he has some sort of standing in the party after a couple of months as a member who I more than likely signed up. Keep up the good work!
Shae is an idiot. I wish he would leave the party already. Nobody wants him .
Hey folks, if we could tone down the rhetoric it would be greatly appreciated. Critiquing Shae's support of Justin Trudeau or anything else he puts out on his blog is fair game but I don't think the personal attacks are necessary.
Shae, while I may not agree with many of your posts, I appreciate and respect your coming down to my corner of the blogosphere to defend them. I think Harper knows that he will not get the majority he seeks unless he embraces the entire Tory contingent. Witness the reemergence of Marjorie LeBreton and Hugh Segal - the rumours of the neo-cons taking over the Conservatives are greatly exaggerated with these folks around. I personally hope the more ardent right wingers continue to form a small faction of the party. After all, don't they continue to exist even at the provincial level under McFadyen?
I hope Shae does not embarrass himself and run for the liberals federally. Joy Smith will crush him.
I appreciate that, Unapologetic Winnipegger. While I would likely defend your initial post, unfortunately the comments seem solely intentded to attack me personally with no intention of really debating the direction of the party. I'd appreciate if you could email me to discuss some of these issues further.
As an aside, for those who don't think Justin is Pierre, Steve Janke's site mentions Michel Auger's blog. Auger's blog entry on January 9, 2007 has choice excerpts from a Radio Canada interview with Justin:
"Mais l’humilité n’a qu’un temps. Vers la fin de l’entrevue, quand Mme Charrette lui demande s’il est trop jeune pour aller en politique, il répond :
J’ai voyagé tellement dans tous les coins de la planète, je connais le Canada, j’ai des choses à dire et des valeurs profondes que mon père m’a données, que lui, ça lui a pris toute une vie pour les développer, mais nous, ils nous les a données toutes faites."
and more tellingly:
"Dans la même entrevue, Justin Trudeau était incapable de nommer une seule chose avec laquelle il puisse critiquer son père. Pas même l’imposition de la Loi des mesures de guerre en 1970. Tout au plus, admettra-t-il qu’il n’a pas assez parlé d’environnement, mais c’est la faute de son époque, dit-il."
I had THREE critiques of P.E.T. - and I was just getting started. If he can't critique his father, it's probably because he thinks just like him...
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